By dennismary.slave@gmail.com 
Women’s cycling has shifted up a few gears, but finding the right bike as a woman can be tricky. Are women’s specific bikes needed in the bike industry or do we need a wider range of bike frame sizes? Manon interviews various cycling industry experts to get their take on women’s bikes.
00:00 Intro
01:13 Sturdy Cycles interview
06:29 Pronto Bikes interview
10:00 Canyon statement
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Do we need women's specific bikes? 🚺
I’m 5’ 10” and ride an XS bike. It’s a little too big for me. Lolz
I can’t imagine being a small rider.
Bike shops favorite thing to do is to sell bikes that are too big.
a bit disappointed that GCN did not interview LIV , a company that specifically design bikes for women. It would be good to hear both sides of the story, rather than just their own sponsors.
My girlfriend bought a “women’s” virus Mythique, MTB. It was cheaper because it was “women’s”. With some digging and an email from virus themselves said the only difference was the stem was 10mm shorter. That’s it.
I have to ride a 44cm frame, which took me a year to find. My local Specialized store just happened to post an IG story selling a Diverge so I snapped it up! I always get comments I should buy a Liv, but I love my bike and with a bike fit session, it fits me perfectly. Thanks for the video!
As a woman who is small size 1.50cm like me living in Vietnam, i really don't have to much choices besides liv giant alight 2. For me, it was a little to much over my budget but i decided to bought that bike, no more choices. Hopefully, my health will be better with cycling.
Having just spent quite a while with my wife buying a bike id say 2 things. 1 wheel size. 2 handlebar width.
In the horrible– but very visible, especially to entry-level, casual, and working-class riders– world of big box store bikes, I've noticed a lot more women-specific labeling. I have to wonder just how cynical a money-grabbing attempt this is, given that bikes at this range are optimized for, well, no one. I'm a penniless American student and I've been riding a big box store women's bike for a while now, and the experience has been consistently worse than ungendered bikes in the same range.
In other words, a bike built to suit the individual is best, but most people will never want to spend the money on a tailor-made frame.
Trying to get back into cycling after a 30 year hiatus (14 to 44 years old), and immediately found my old bike – Univega Alpina mtb – to be exactly agonising, nothing as where i wanted it or where i could get comfortable with; putting your back out 5 times makes at difference, apparently. Measuring where i actually wanted/needed things to be to be able to ride for more than 10 minutes, and every geometry diagram i ended up being closet to was a "women's" mtb. Everything was too long, with too-low bars, and pedals that were too under the seat.
The perfect bike turned out to be a Carrera Intercity folder. Every time i look at it i keep thinking if the frame was non-folding, with a more regular downtube, and gearing to match a road bike, they'd sell loads of them.
I think if reach is an issue on smaller 700c frames then perhaps that could be compensated by zero stems and lowering the cross bar. I wonder if it's marketing or the dreaded UCI that stop this kind of innovation.
I would love to see you interview/ profile Georgena Terry!
Very interesting topic, thanks for that.
About the sloping top tube for women's bikes, my girlfriend appreciates those, not because she's cycling in a skirt/dress but because it's easier to hop on versus swinging your leg over the frame.
That said, the sizing thing is spot on. As a below average height man myself (168cm), it wasn't until I got a XS Canyon that I realized I've always been riding frames too big for me !
Great job Manon! Keep it up
I’m a short person who rides, thankful for smaller bikes.
When I was in the bike shop business it was more often the case that women were more difficult to fit than men.
And not just the very small women, that is another subject altogether.
We did sell a bike that used 650b front wheel that allowed keeping the overall frame proportional.
This greatly facilitated getting the reach and stack correct.
I do recall many more cases of women having issues with frame geometry than men.
It was usually tall women with very long legs or very short men and women that were the hardest to fit.
As a shorter man (possibly 171cm), with even shorter legs, I’ve managed with 700c wheels and 170mm cranks… but only just.
Excellent video. I ride a 48 inch Diverge, ordered the Women's version and the Men's came in to the store. Wouldn't have noticed a difference and would have needed to make the same personalization on either model. Still love it! Would love to see a video on cycling clothing specific to women. That's the one area where I have the hardest time. Everything is made for smaller women and us who are a bit larger struggle to find quality kit that fits us.
When I purchased my Specialized in 2019, my shop’s staff told me that was the last year they expected to see “mens” and “womens” bikes offered. I’m not sure that ended up happening as quickly as they thought, but looking at the major “serious” brands I think I agree with what Manon and her guests have said here now.
I think it would even be in brands’ best interests to do away with gender in their stock, as it reduces the number of “models” that need to be tracked and managed (even if the parts are identical, in some part of the logistics chain they need to be separated, at least at the end-item level). It might even help justify having larger variations in a product’s range, as it might remove some stigma for smaller men buying smaller components that would previously been marketed as “women’s”.
That said, there is a market segment that is still firmly in the “mens/womens/boys/girls” mode – brands that you would find at, say, Walmart. That is, bicycles sold by non-cyclist sellers for non-cyclist customers, where style and low price reign supreme, rather than performance and durability. And the need to draw customers out of that segment into that where the bike shop lives remains as strong as ever.
I own a unisex Bianchi and a Liv Langma and far prefer my Liv. I've had bike fits on both so I know they are set up correctly but the Liv just feels so much more comfortable. I think it's ultimately down to the individual as to what suits them, but I'm personally glad there are still women's specific options available. Great video but it would have been good to speak to a brand like Liv and hear their perspective too.
So for short adults & jr's the slow death of the 650c wheel was a bad thing.
I think Specialized had the women’s specific range, but they stopped that, because they found that just making a broader range of frame sizes from small to large…
Second video regarding this. While it's a SUPER important topic, I've noticed you havent actually spoken to anyone from a brand that is doing women's specific bikes. So you're getting one side of the story from brands/shops that dont carry any of them, and are obviously not going to push business away. Food for thought. Give LIV a ring… I'm sure they would be happy to chat about the endless amounts of R&D they've put into their product.
Its interesting, in MTB steeper seat tubes and slacker heat tubes bring previously large sizes down a lot, my 5ft8 wife can ride my XL Marin Alpine Trail with a 1300mm wheelbase no problem, reach is so much shorter then it used to be, I wonder if that would work for road cycling frame sizes
Great video Manon! Would love another more in depth one about how women can start to customise their setup more, this video mentions frames, stems and cranks, but I'd love to know more about the how/where to start: I'm 5'7 with an XS Canyon (though Canyon recommends me an M which is way too big), with an 80mm flipped stem and 38 handlebars… but I didn't know to do that myself, so more of these detailed 'learner/starter' vids would be awesome please!
Also maybe one comparing a Liv and a similar Canyon would be great to see too with what the differences are!
My first bike was a 2nd hand Specialized Dolce Elite. It was some time before I realised it was a ladies bike. I didn't have a clue about size. I didn't even know how to use the shifters. Luckily, with my short legs, it suited me quite well and is still in use on my turbo. I've done over 13K miles on it.
It would have been nice to have the opinion of someone who believes that women specific bikes make sense. Is it just commercial bullshitting, or are there some specific subtle things that justify them? Women might not need specific geometry, but would it nevertheless still be a good thing?
Obviously it’s more expensive to develop, produce, and distribute more types of frames for the same amount of customers, but Giant/Liv firmly believe it's justifiable for the end user.
I’m sure it all comes down to a question of cost for the manufacturer vs the pricetag for the customer.
Thanks for the stellar content again gcn and Manon! I'm a guy and I was fascinated throughout! The bike industry is obsessed with male riders and caters to this niche to everyone's detriment. Reminds me a bit of the videos that gcn years back did with Emma Pooley and her struggle to get a bike that fit. She opted for 650B wheels back before it became popular. I love that you covered many bases: custom frame builder who understands kinetics, bike shop owner, and a big bike brand as well as Manon's lived experience as a pro racer. I will let women's voices speak up for what they want to see Manon investigate next, bit rest assured, I WILL be watching anything you produce on this topic next! It's so important that we start taking smaller stature/weight athletes seriously. You want evidence? You just have to watch poor Hank struggling with Conor's 36" wheeled monster bike! Let's get bikes that fit everyone in the hands of those that need them! Eagerly awaiting the next video!!
Not trying to be funny or weird, but. being male, I kind of noticed when I was 12 yrs old, that women are very 'different' biologically, to men. So why would a mans designed bike suit a woman? Not even a bike size makes sense. Women are built very differently to men. You'd think a man would understand this. But historically, men built bikes… For men. But oh, we can make them smaller for women. So simple! Nope! You see , women have different sizes of their sized bra's for one example. That creates different issues. Their age means that that're pelvic area's change over time, This is a long list so I will stop now. But my point is made. On size does not fit all. Simple.
Perhaps 12 yr old boy's who really know the difference between men and women should be designing bikes for women, ha ha! better still, perhaps woman should be!
Thankfully we are coming out of the dark ages. At last!
I’m 172 cm tall and have a Canyon WMN Ultimate in size S. So no need for smaller wheels. Still, I am very happy with my women-specific bike as I also tried their unisex version of the same bike when I visited Canyon in Koblenz, and I felt much more comfortable on the women-specific frame and set-up. Going by their online sizing, I was right in the middle of XS or S, so thought I’d better travel there to test ride before ordering online. I am very glad I did. Interestingly, in the unisex model, the XS frame fit me better. Not sure what to do now if I want to get a new one. Will probably be travelling over again, just to make sure…
Get Dr. Stacy Sims on. She is an exercise physiologist and nutritionist and focusses specifically on female athletes. A lot of training advice going around today is based on evidence from studies done on men (not women) and women have a lot of different needs due to their hormonal and other physiological differences. She's an ex pro cyclist and would have some really great insights for women's training and nutrition on and off the bike.
I think they have that wrong , i have had 2 liv bike and my friend has 1 the reach is to short on all . Its not just making the top tube shorter . I am 5ft2 and my friend 5ft 10 so not a hight thing for this . I do love giant tho
When my wife decided she wanted a road bike, we looked at a lot of options but eventually went with a Liv. The main reason was that she has smaller hands, and some of the unisex bikes she found the reach to the brake levers uncomfortably long. This meant that she was not at all confident on steeper descents. The Liv sorts that problem, and as a bonus the model she chose also has slave levers on the bars, which work really well for her.
It would be interesting to get some comment from bike builders such as Liv to see what they have to say in regard to better meeting the needs of women. Not that I disagree with any of the video, but it would be nice to have those views included.
I am male but I brought one second hand by accident. The width is better for me cause I don't have wide shoulders. At certain turning angles the tip of my toes hit the wheel. When I first got it my shoulders were tired because I wasn't used to the angle but now it's fine. I'm mostly happy with it.
Great video Manon and I can’t wait to see more videos on this topic! I’m interested to know more about 650b vs 700c wheels and if there’s much of a performance difference. As a 5’2 female I should probably opt for 650b wheels however I’ve always gone for 700 – perhaps slightly out of stubbornness but also because some people say 650b don’t roll as well? Not sure how much truth there is in that though…
The main thing that puts me off buying a women’s specific bike is that they’re always pink or purple. We like other colours too you know 😂
I have a friend who is 4'8" (142 cm) and it's impossible to find satisfactory adult bikes, there's no fun road bikes and no commuting/e-bikes she feels safe on, and as a result she gave up cycling 😔🤬
I tried looking into the options, there's not much for people under 4'11", and a few things I noted:
Inseam/height ratio varies between individuals, typically around 0.45 – 0.46, but on average there is no difference between men and women, just outlier individuals who have long legs with short torsos, and vice versa.
What we're left with in terms of women specific bikes is more often a need for narrower handle bars to compliment narrower shoulders, and wider saddles to accommodate wider sit bones, but neither of these things is actually wholly unique to women either.
650c wheels are extremely rare these days, and it might be better than 650b because 650c is slightly smaller, 571 mm vs 584 mm. 650c used to popular for TT aero and triathlon, and could be a solution to getting the saddle to bar drop on very small sizes, as well as reducing toe overlap.
I note that some brands e.g. Merida have XXXXS (4XS) sizes for the Asian markets, but they're still not small enough for 4'8" riders, and appear to still use 700c wheels 🤷♂
What I personally want to see is 5XS and 6XS size frames for adults N.B. telling small adults to ride youth or kids bikes is patronising and bad for mental health becuase small people are already subject to being infantilised on a regular basis.
Offering 650b is a step in the right direction, but I would like to see a return of 650c, and maybe even manufacturers experimenting with 600c. Maybe it only has to be the front wheels? Either way, I think it will require bike, wheel, and tyre manufacturers to agree to collaborate, but the overall product performance needs to be competitive to be fair.
I think the UCI could potentially help by revisiting the rules on what shape bikes have to be. I remember Conor talking about the aero bikes in size 61 and above looking odd because the seat tube cannot follow the wheel arc in those sizes due to UCI regulations. Maybe small bike need lower minimum weight limits, narrower minimum bar widths, and something to compensate for any performance penalty of smaller wheels?
The bigger ethical/moral question for me is: should larger bicycle manufacturers for forced by law to produce bikes (and brakes, shifters, wheels and tyres) in outlier sizes to accommodate everyone who is very short?
If the UCI change the rules and got women racing with smaller wheels then all bike manufacturers would be forced to have women specific bikes.
Such a small and difficult range of gear available to small women. Extremely annoying if you take cycling seriously and want aero gains. Helmets, SHOES especially. Many manufacturers stop doing half sizes under EU 39 or don’t offer eg wide fit for them
The news said the Warner Bros will move the GCN to MAX, and what will happen to this channel?
In all honesty I think UCI rules should be updated to make everyone ride 406mm rims, tt bars and step through frame.
The bike needs to be bikefit to our body … it does care if it is women or men … industry needs to build frames and acessories to fit everybody
As a salesperson in the bike industry I think one of my biggest frustrations is brands not offering enough sizes. I am a man and about 5 foot 6 and honestly struggle to find things that fit. Fortunately I am inside the industry to be able to fix the problem. If you are new to the sport it can be awfully intimidating when you aren’t a medium man riding a medium bike in medium clothes and I think the bike industry lets people at both ends of the hight spectrum down.
Women's specdic bikes are crap. They are the same size as mens. Just make bikes in smaller sizes. Also we dont want stupid 650b wheels b/c there are limited options for rims and tires
Women's specific bicycles can hardly be resold to male youth riders because they don't want to buy women's bikes. If only a women's saddle is mounted, it can easily be exchanged for a men's saddle.
I agree regarding Pinarello, lots of frame sizes if its in your budget , I love mine.